Retired Members Guild

Executive meeting

September 2017-09-14

250 Tremblay

Ottawa Ontario


Pat Kinnear – President Atlantic

Sue Ramsay – VP and acting Treasurer BC/Yukon

Charlotte Strandlund, Secretary

Elie Ahad, Quebec

Michael Forbes, Ontario

Bill Giggie, NCR

Nita Saville, NCR

Absent/Regrets: Richard Rice, NCR and

Terry Sing, NCR, Friend of the Guild

Guests: Don Eldershaw, Atlantic

Dr. Russel – 100th Anniversary Committee

1. Call to order at 9:10

President Pat Kinnear, opened the meeting with a minute of silence for Mike Seiden

2. Introductions

Pat welcomed everyone to the meeting.

3. Agenda

Pat Kinear moved approval of the agenda as distributed, Seconded by Bill Gigggie. Motion Carried.

4. 2018 Vision Committee and RMG Executive Meeting Dates

Bill Giggie move acceptance of the 2018 meeting dates for the Vision Committee Meetings and RMG Executive Meetings. Seconded by Michael Forbes. Motion Carried.

5. RMG January 11, 2018 Executive meeting

Motion moved by Charlotte Strandlund and Seconded by Sue Ramsay that Elie Ahad be appointed the Elections Chair for the RMG Executive meeting on January 11, 2018 and that Elie Ahad also chair the meeting until the new President is elected as the first order of business for the meeting, further that Elie Ahad chair the Vision Committee meeting on January 10, 2018 until the new Vice President is elected.

Motion Carried.

6. RMG Elections Results

Elections Committee Report presented by Bill Giggie, for the RMG Election that closed on September 6, 2017.

Elections Committee was Richard Rice and Bill Giggie

Position / Candidates

Atlantic Regional Representative 

Don Eldershaw (elected)

Patrick Kinnear

NCR Regional Representative

Terry Sing (elected)

Alan Shusterman

Urania (Nita) Saville

Ontario Regional Representative

Michael Forbes (acclaimed)

BC/Yukon Regional Representative

Don Burns (elected)

Alfred Lyon

Susan E Ramsay

Motion, Bill Giggie moved acceptance of the Elections Report seconded by Nita Saville, Motion Carried.

7. Approval of Minutes

Charlotte Strandlund Moved acceptance of the draft June 8, 2017 meeting minutes as distributed, Seconded by Sue Ramsay, Motion Carried

7.1 Business Arising


7.1.1Creation of Benefits Committee

7.1.2 Allowing Chapter Presidents and/or designate be allowed to attend RMG/AGM at PIPSC cost is addressed in these minutes under Bylaw changes.

8. RMG/REO Reports

8. 1 Presidents Report.

Is attached to these minutes.

President Pat Kinnear spoke on the Phoenix System and that it took Australia years to fix the system. He stated that the Federal Government is now offering employees a $4,000.00 payout to drop their complaints.

He further stated that membership in the Retired Members Guild is down as current workers are not retiring because they are afraid that they will not be paid.

He also spoke on Bill C27 and that our fight on this issue is far from over.

9. Treasurers Report.

Sue Ramsay presented the Treasurers Report. She requested that all RMG ERO Reports and Receipts be given to her so that she could review the receipts in order for her to issue the cheques at our November meeting.

Motion, Bill Giggie moved that RMG finance provide a partial allotment to Michael Forbes in order for him to complete Mike Seiden’s term of office. Seconded by Elie Ahad, Motion Carried.

Treasurer Sue Ramsay advised that Alan Shusterman had reviewed the RMG financial records and books. She stated that the books and records are in good standing.

Motion moved by Sue Ramsay and Seconded by Bill Giggie that one member be approved to attend the inaugural meeting of the new Newfoundland Labrador (NF) Chapter along with two nights’ accommodation. Motion Carried

Note: NF Chapter Meeting scheduled for October 17, 2017

Motion, Moved by Sue Ramsay that Terry Sing attend the NF Chapter meeting. Seconded by Charlotte Strandlund

Motion Carried.

Motion moved by Sue Ramsay and Seconded by Michael Forbes acceptance of the financial report. Motion Carried.


The Vision Committee report was presented by Vision Committee Chair Sue Ramsay and is attached to these minutes.

11. RMG Bylaw Amendments

11.1 Motion moved by Sue Ramsay and Seconded by Elie Ahad that under Bylaw 8 Elections, point 8.10 remove the words (following the announcement of the results of the election, and replace them with :

Following the Guild AGM. The current RMG core executive to continue in their current roles until the newly elected executive take office. Motion Carried.

. (Note: amended 8.10 now read)

8.10 New, the newly elected Executive shall take office at the first meeting of the Guild executive following the Guild AGM. The current RMG core executive to continue their current roles until the newly elected executives take office.

8.2 By-law 9 – General Meetings of the Guild, Motion made Pat Kinnear changes to Bylaw 9, seconded by Charlotte seconded. Motion Carried.



9.1 Annual General Meeting

9.1.1 The Annual General Meeting of the Guild shall be held the day before and at the location of the PIPSC AGM and shall be open to all members of the Guild who wish to attend at their own expense.

9.1.2 NEW- Each chapter in good standing shall be permitted to send their chapter President or designate to attend the Guild AGM, the costs of which will be covered by PIPSC as is the custom for other constituent bodies.

91.3 Renumbered – The National Executive shall call an Annual General Meeting of the Guild once each calendar year. The interval between such meetings shall not exceed fifteen (15) months. Members shall be notified of the meeting and of any proposed changes to this constitution at least four (4) weeks prior to the date of the meeting. The notice of the Guild meeting at which the amendments will be considered, shall include the wording of the article to be amended as well at the proposed wording.

Note: Pat Kinnear will ensure that the all Bylaw motions are sent to translation and put in the package for the RMG AGM.

12. RMG Facebook Page

Motion, Moved by Nita Saville and Seconded by Michael Forbes, that the current executive supports that Pat Kinnear continue to administer the RMG Facebook. Motion carried.


14.1 RMG/AGM Parliamentarian

Motion, Sue Ramsay moved that the RMG invite Gordon Bulmer to be the Parliamentarian at the 2017 RMG AGM Seconded by Bill Giggie. Motion Carried

Note, President Pat Kinnear will send the request to Gordon Bulmer.

14.2 RMG/AGM Hospitality

Motion, Sue moved, that the budget for the RMG Hospitality Suite be the same amount as last year. Seconded by Bill Giggie. Motion Carried.

Note: Lucienne will be in charge of the suite and will submit report and receipts to the RMG Executive.

Motion Moved by Sue Ramsay and Seconded by Elie Ahad acceptance of the Vision Committee report. Motion Carried.

(The Vision Committee Report is attached to these minutes)

Motion, moved Sue Ramsay and Seconded by Charlotte Strandlund acceptance of all REO reports be as presented. Motion carried.

Note all reports are attached to these minutes.

14. Round Table

Everyone had an opportunity to speak under round table discussion.

15. Next Meeting

RMG Executive – Morning November 16, 2017

RMG/AGM – Afternoon November 16, 2017

16. 2018 RMG and Vision Committee Meeting Dates

Vision / Executive

January 10 / January 11

May 15 / May 16

September 12 / September 13

November (none) / November 1, (RMG Ex. Morning) (RMG/AGM Afternoon)

17. Adjournment.

Sue Ramsay moved adjourned at 2:30



Vision Committee Report. Sue Ramsay

Chapters/President Report

Minutes - Not posted recent minutes and AGM

Executive of chapters and the status of Membership dues – have the executives paid all their dues

Victoria Chapter funding

Funds should be released as they now have a BMO account


Lucienne will now be a delegate of the AGM

Resolution for AGM By-law change 8.10 and amend 170913-2

To be amended – shall take office following the Guild AGM

Current bylaws – current newly elected

Recommendation: pass


Resolution for By-Law change – funding 9.1.2

Each chapter in good standing shall be permitted to send their chapter President or delegate to attend the Guild AGM, this rests of which will be covered by PIPSC as is the custom for other constituent bodies.

Funding for chapter presidents to attend Guild PIPSC AGM as they are – How are we funded?


Newsletter Not sent out in a timely manner in the past

Pat offered to do the Newsletter if people send it out

Do members want a Newsletter?

Facebook Page Pat put it up (Nov 15th 2014) and he can take it down – if no longer required – 89 members on Facebook

Recommendation: Allow Pat Kinnear to be the custodian continue to maintain and nourish the Facebook page

Treasurer’s report

Documentation received for the transfer – books reviewed and ok – Al Shusterman reviewed request that he send the report – files for this year came back from Richard

Where are the previous files?

Role of Vision Committee and RMG Executive

What is the role? The future of Vision committee – sub committee

10 years

Various issues to research

Role of the Guild

Ask members of the executive – why did they join and are still being involved


Status of the survey there has not been one since about 8 years

Content of the survey should reflect what the need is and what do you want to accomplish?

100th Anniversary

Writer is working very hard and going through the archival material

There will not be an old timer’s luncheon, the researcher will be interviewing the individuals himself. The conversations will be videotaped. 32 on the list, background has been given to the writer

At the PIPSC AGM there will be individuals that will be video taped

Group Questionnaire is being still worked on by the groups (history of each group)

Champions – representative from each Region

Media – website, e-store, tool kit etc. – an area in the Member Portal for the 100th Anniversary Committee members (includes Champions across the country) all the documents that could be used

Next meeting will be December 13th

New Executive – meeting 170913-3

Date of the new meeting will be decided by the executive

Recommendation: for the first 2018 meeting January 10th Vision and January 11th is the exec

Elie has agreed to be the chair of the January Vision committee of the new meeting (motion to be made by Charlotte)

Ballots will be prepared by Lucienne and sent in

Additional dates 2018

May Tues and Wednesday 15th and 16th

September 12th and 13th

November 1st (PIPSC – AGM Nov 2&3)

Think the AGM will be Nov 2 & 3


2,712 total membership

NCR is the largest 1080

Membership down due to Phoenix

Phoenix – not useable, $142 Million dollars a year, legacy system is or is not operational?

AGM Agenda notification

Middle of October

2017 Report of the President

Send an email to Brigitte to get the draft emails of the 2016 report

Voting by proxy

Non- Profit Sturgis - Ill-advised unless specifically included in the constitution

Retirement Links

Request received – email sent on this issue on – final pay for retired members

Member question

Retirement Links – copy will be sent to team members to add to it as needed – further resources to be added to

Stewart will be thanked for input and continue contact with member

Member question

Sub groups - regular per diem for meals?

Parliamentarian for the AGM meeting

Terry will ask Gord Bulman if he would do it.

Observer status for Lucienne

Charlotte has notified Julie

Hospitality Suite

Purpose for RM it would opportunity to have a drink and say hello – not spend a lot of time

Friday – 4-6 and Sat after the AGM 4-6 at the end put up their feet

Invitation – to be done at the AGM

Budget – wine and beer, soft drinks, chips and light munchies snack food - pretzels –

No Invitation to be sent out

Word of Mouth

Recommendation: $xxxxxx budget

Motions – 170913-1

NL chapter opening up October 17th – show full support and someone from the RMG should be there to show great initiative – continue – have not received any money to date -


Precedent could be set here

Who will go


1. Mike Seiden

We lost Mike, Ontario REO and GTA chapter President who died suddenly in July. Our condolences to his family, friends and colleagues.

2. RMG Elections

Congratulations to the newly elected REO’s- Don Burns,

Mike Forbes, Terry Sing and Don Eldershaw.

I want to thank all the candidates for putting their names forward for the Executive.

I want to thank the Election Committee, Chair Richard Rice, Bill Giggie and Brigitte Jolin for their work on the election.

3. Phoenix Pay System

Still a boondoggle. Although there has been some progress, on the whole it is still broken and there is no time frame on when it will be fixed.

It took 5 years for the same system to be operational in Australia.

In fact, the Australian Government warned the Harper Government about Phoenix payroll system but they ignored the warning. On August 29, the Government announced financial incentives to attract qualified employees

To address the Phoenix program.

They are now offering one time payments of $4,000, temporarily increasing overtime rates from time and a half to double-timeand temporarily dropping

Restrictions on the amount of vacation that compensation advisors can carry over. They hope this will improve the "…recruitment and retention of compensation advisors…”

4. Bill C-27

We are still campaigning against this bill. This is high priority for PIPSC and the other Federal Government Unions as well as the CLC, Federal Retirees, CURC to name a few. This bill has not been withdrawn. Although it has only received 1st reading it is still on the order paper.

As Bill-27 is now written, it does not affect the core Public Service. We must keep up the pressure to have the Bill withdrawn. If it is passed, it is inevitable that it will cover the entire Public Service. The employer could bring in Bill C-27

for new employees and/or they could encourage current employees to accept a Target Pension plan (which is basically what Bill C-27 is all about) by offering a signing bonus to switch.

5. RMG Facebook Group

We created the group on November 15 2014. It is slowly growing

And we now have 89 members. This will no doubt increase as more and younger folks from the digital age retire.

6. Avalon Chapter in NL

This new chapter which was established in the spring is having their first AGM on October 19.

Patrick Kinnear





The campaign against Bill C-27 is alive and growing. The RMG and its Chapters, including the NCR Chapter are active participants in the CLC-led national campaign along with the National Association of Federal Retirees, the Congress of Union Retirees of Canada (CURC), and many seniors’ organizations, including the Ottawa Committee for Pension Security (OCPS) which was formed in January 2017. The OCPS comprises a group of concerned individuals who came together to support retirement security for all. The committee has organized a sit-in rally to be held on September 18, 2017, timed for the opening day of Parliament, and aimed at gaining significant media coverage.


The Chapter AGM and Elections will be held on October 18th at the Mandarin Restaurant on Hunt Club Road in Ottawa. The elections are for three Member-at-large positions, each for a three year term. An update on Bill C-27 will be a highlight presentation at this meeting.


Medical Marijuana or Weed and Feed

An evening seminar on “Medical Marijuana" (English) was held on June 14, 2017 at the PIPSC National Office. This seminar was for those curious about the medical uses of Cannabis and featured speaker, Maddie Brown R.P.N. National Access Cannabis, an expert in helping patients to access and use medical marijuana treatments. The participants were retired or soon-to-be-retired members and their spouses.

Travel Tips and Tricks

The next seminar is an evening session on September 28, 2017 to be held at the PIPSC National Office, entitled "Travel Tips and Tricks". Topics will include insurance, passports, travel advisories and special considerations such as “what you want to know",the who, what, when, and where of great travel deals (In English). Registration deadline: Monday, September 25.

Upcoming seminar details and registration instructions are posted on the chapter's seminar website at:


This is an excellent account of activities submitted by Terry who is among our most active PIPSC RMG members/ volunteers and who is instrumental in reinforcing our ties with many of the NCR-based organizations that share our mutual goals and objectives.


Terry Sing and Nita Saville are members of the Committee. In recent months, following a rigorous selection process by the Institute, a researcher was hired to identify, collect and document PIPSC historical material. The researcher, Dr Jason Russel will be meeting with “old timers" attending the PIPSC AGM in November, taking advantage of their convenient availability and willingness to share their memories of PIPSC individually and collectively. It is expected that some 30 plus Retirees from across Canada will be attending this year's AGM.


PSAC Dental Plan: PSAC Has Filed for Arbitration

The employer remains unwilling to negotiate a number of improvements to the plan brought forth by PSAC despite the fact that there have been no improvements to the Plan in almost a decade. If unable to come to an agreement with the employer through mediation, the arbitration board will make a binding decision on changes to the dental plan.

Four Reasons That Retirement Is Costing Canadians More Than Ever (Excerpt)

Source: Jason Heath, Financial Post 07.12.2017

Retirement is getting more expensive for Canadians and it has been for quite a while. Retirement is costingmore due to four primary factors, namely, longevity, pension trends, interest rates and investment fees.

According to Statistics Canada, in 1992, Canadian life expectancy at age 65 was 18 years. Currently, a 65-year old can expect to live for about 21 years. Another contributor to the increased cost of retirement is the decline in guaranteed defined benefit (DB) pension income. It is a well-known fact that DB pension coverage has decreased for retirees over the years as fewer companies offer such plans. It is not a well-appreciated fact that DB pension income comes from forced savings — contributions from employees and employers.

This report was prepared and submitted by Nita Saville on behalf of the RMG NCR EROs. Sincere thanks to all for your valuable input.


(RMG National Executive Meeting /September 14th, 2017)

Submitted by, Michael Forbes

Having just been acclaimed as the Ontario REO there is very little to report and so I will introduce myself and outline some of goals I have as representative for the Ontario Region.

I worked over 45 years in the Public Service mostly for Environment Canada and Climate Change as the Department is now called. I worked as an ultra-trace organic chemist, water quality laboratory manager and in the latter part of my career as a Science Liaison Officer at the Canada Centre for Inland Waters in Burlington, Ontario gaining experience in science policy.

I have experience and knowledge serving PIPSC members and have promoted scientific integrity and advocated for Public Science and Evidence Based Policy:

I have been an active PIPSC member as outlined below:

  • Steward 2003-2013
  • SP Group Executive Committee 2009-2017
  • Science Advisory Committee member 2009-2014, 2016-2017
  • Member of Elections Appeals Committee 2015
  • Past President, Hamilton Burlington Branch
  • Past President, Hamilton Burlington SP Sub-Group
  • Ontario Regional Executive Member 2010-2014
  • Executive Member EC Consultation Team 2009-2013

I am currently serving as an SP Group Executive member and as a member of the Science Advisory Committee.

This summer I was privileged to contribute to the development of a PIPSC model Scientific Integrity Policy. I was active as a member of the SP Group Bylaws Committee, updating SP Group Bylaws compliant with the PIPSC Model Bylaws.

My goals are to work on behalf of Ontario RMG members to defend their rights and protect our members’ pension and health and dental benefits. I will work to recruit, retain and mobilize Guild Members and would like to form more Chapters in the Ontario Region I believe compellingly in advancing retirement income and health care security for all Canadians. I strongly advocate a National Pharmacare Program so that our members and all Canadians can have access to the medications they require. I am committed to work in solidarity with the Guild Executive and PIPSC to oppose Bill C 27. I will work with our REOs to educate PIPSC members on the amazing talent that the Guild has to offer and to foster the respect that Guild members deserve.

I believe the Guild Executive should develop a Strategic Plan to provide future direction for the Guild


(RMG National Executive Meeting /14 Sep 2017)

Submitted by Elie Ahad

Attended on 22 June and 09 Aug 2017 two Executive Meetings of the RMG Quebec Chapter; the main topics discussed were:

Quebec Chapter AGM and the Executive Elections:

Debi Daviau (PIPSC) accepted our invitation to attend the AGM in Quebec City and make a presentation about Bill C-27. To reserve a dining room at Restaurant Pacini for 10 Oct 2017 and prepare the Agenda and Notice of Meeting for posting on the Website and for distribution to the members . Call for Nominations for the Elections of the new Executive and selection of a Chief Electoral Officer (Gédéon Drouin). The sending of all this documentation to the members will be done on Sep 15th in order to meet the deadline prescribed in the Bylaws. To obtain from PIPSC a recent list of Chapter members.

Table of Consultation for Quebec Seniors: This organization handles too many files despite the fact that it has lost half its members and received less public funds. It is necessary to reassess the mission of this Consultation Table.

The Quebec Section of the National Association of Federal Retirees (NAFR) has suffered cuts in funding.

RMG - BC/Yukon Report

September 13th 2017

The follow is the report for BC/Yukon Region from June 2017 to Sept 2017.

Due to summer there has not been much in the way of activity.


Nil Report


Nil Report


Nil Report

Susan E. Ramsay

BC / Yukon Region

Prairie/N.W.T. Region Report

Submitted By Charlotte Strandlund

September 14, 2017

It has been a very quiet summer and so not much to report. I sent an email to Edmonton and Winnipeg RMG Chapters prior to this report.

Edmonton RMG Chapter has nothing to report for this meeting.

Winnipeg RMG Chapter President Paul Schick sent me the following question, which I have forwarded to our Finance Officer Sue Ramsay for further clarification and for her to respond to Paul Schick.

His question: For sub-groups and Branches having regular (not AGM) meetings, they can claim per-diems fir lunch or suppers. Can we do that? It would seem to me that we should be able to, if we are really treated as Branches?? With a limited budget would definitely help.


June 7, 2017 – September 14, 2017

“SUMMER-TIME & the living is easy”, or so the song says.


AV SITUATION – It continues to highlight how “AGEISM” continues to be our nemesis. Ray Paquette tried to defeat the motion that now forces AV executive members, who haven’t completed their elected term of office, to step down from office as soon as they are retired. “To Fight, or not to Fight, that is the question …”

28th CLC CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION, MAY 8, Toronto – This is bound to come up at the National Convention in November & the RMG may, or may not, be singled out for having been selected to attend – be aware. The answer is: It cost less than $ for me to attend versus ~$ for others; my cost was easily covered by the surplus money the RMG contribute to PIPSC bottom-line every year; I’m a participating CLC member; & I’m a visible minority.


STOP BILL C-27 – The Ottawa Committee for Pension Security [OCPS] is planning a sit-in rally for Sept 18. This could gain important media attention & is timed for the opening day of Parliament. C-27 is still alive & on-going threat to our pensions.

ADVISORY COMMITTEE [AC] – The Working Group on Consultation & the Advisory Committee met Aug 25th & 26th [see Agendas for updates]

SEMINAR SERIES – “Weed & Feed” was less successful than anticipated. About 15 interested souls learned about medical Marijuana. The next presentation is Sept 28; has 47 people signed up; the topic is MEDOC TRAVEL Insurance. Members appreciate that the RMG is offering these sessions.

100th ANNIVERSARY COMMITTEE – Dr Jason Russel is hard at work researching PIPSC. There was a small reception to welcome him before consigning him to the salt mines. The CS group found the minutes of their 1st meeting maybe we have our 1st meeting minutes somewhere?

NAFR [National Association of Federal Retirees]: The National Office [NO] has been relatively quiet but the Ottawa Branch [OB] has been active.

NO – will be holding a series of town-halls across Canada to explore adequacy of the Canadian Forces & RCMP “Transition to Civilian Life” program. A flyer went out to members notifying them that the Government was hiring [back] people with Human Resource skills to work on the PHOENIX system [God help them]

OB – the OB has filled its’ vacancies on its’ Board, started a marketing initiative, & hired a new director. The Fall General Meeting is scheduled for Oct 24 & I am coordinating the 18+ INFOMART displays. Respite Care training is being offered to members.

SENIORS ROUNDTABLE - CITY OF OTTAWA – The United Nations “Day of the Older Person” Flag Raising will take place on Sept 28 in conjunction with CARP & CURC. Work continues on the various 2017 Roundtable initiatives.

COUNCIL ON AGING [COA] – 2018 priorities are: Seniors Social Isolation; Hospital parking; Updating the “FACT book on Aging in Ottawa”; & Member Orientation events. I attended their AGM but avoided volunteering for any more work.


  1. BBQ’s are still going on as the last of summer approaches
  2. PRIDE Week was successful & PIPSC was in the parade
  3. The Labor Day parade will have a PIPSC bus with seniors & others on it
  4. The NCR region has asked to have some RMG members work at the Stewards Council Sept 29-30 [we have 4 people available]
  5. Game of Thrones season seven has ended & “WINTER HAS ARRIVED”.